Phone Talk With Madhav Nepal, Hridayesh Tripathy

I just got off the phone. Two days back I had called a whole bunch of them: Madhav K. Nepal, Arjun Nar Singh KC, Lilamani pokharel, Amik serchan, Dr.Minendra Rijal, Hridayesh Tripathy, and Narayan Man Bijukchhe. But I had not been able to get hold of any of them. They were all out of town for political work.

Today I called two of them: Madhav K. Nepal and Hridayesh Tripathy. I was able to get hold of both of them.

Madhav Nepal was concerned that some Nepali organization in the US had come out opposing the 12 point agreement between the seven parties and the Maoists and was getting a lot of media coverage. I informed him that was a minor organization I had never heard of. "There are Mandales also in the US, but they are few in number." I just emailed him the NAC statement that came out in support.

Nepal was pleased with the recent statement from Seantor Leahy. He said it would be really helpful if other Senators, Governors and prominent US political figures similarly put out statements. He also wished there were similar statements from prominent UN people.

He complained the regime had gone out of its way to obstruct recent UML rallies.

"If there is a military crackdown, that would be a violation of international laws, and you all should be seeking ways to get lawyers to take the king to the International Criminal Court, because as head of the government, it would be his direct responsibility," Nepal said.

He said people in the hundreds of thousands are going to show up for the rallies down the line. Both the UML and the Congress have elaborate programs. The fear among the people has been dissipating. We are woking to get 400,000 people out in Janakpur, he said.

I asked about fundraising at this end. He was not against the idea, but the transparency part was not a good idea, he said. It would not look good for the seven parties to present a budget. If we were to set up a joint bank account, the government will likely seize it, he said.

But his major emphasis was on getting moral support.

I asked him about the House reinstatement issue. I asked if all seven parties were solidly behind it. He said there was no disagreement, and the UML was behind it for unity. But he said there were problems. The UML would prefer a national conference to be the starting point. But it is okay with a reinstated House as the starting point. If the House is reinstated, those who want to retain the 1990 constitution might gain the upper hand, the king might get to play games through parties. But the House revival issue is not an issue of contention between the Congress and us, Nepal emphasized.

I asked who the Prime Minister and Deputy Prime Minister will be when the all party government is formed. He said that has not been decided yet, and that the UML will not hold the coalition hostage on the issue. Our struggle is for democracy, not for a chair. I asked if that means it will be Girija Koirala. Nepal said Koirala has himself said he is not eager, that he has held the chair many times, and his health is also failing.

I expressed my gratitude to him and to the seven party coalition for all it was doing.

Then I got to talk to Hridayesh Tripathy. I spent quite some time with him in the years before I came over to the US. He is sharp and funny.

I asked him also about the House revival idea. He called it a departure point. He said that was a way to make sure the king does not get an excuse to openly step outside the constitution. But he emphasized a movement tends to be dynamic in character. As it gathers strength there could come a point when the seven parties might ditch the House idea and seek another. Those decisions can not be taken now.

I asked if the House is to be revived, how would it come about? His answer: the movement will. This is not an issue in legality. This is to be a political decision. There is no need for total clarity now. During the course of the movement, things become clear as per the developments.

He kept emphasizing the point that a movement is not a static thing, it is dynamic. It is not like an architect drawing the plan for a building. There are too many variables along the way. It is not possible to have all the clarity at this very moment.

I asked who the Prime Minister and the Deputy Prime Minister will be in the all party government. He said that has not been discussed, and that it is not important to discuss that now.

"Nepalis have the tendency to want all or nothing," he said.

He called the February 8 elections "an acid test." If the king can successfully conduct elections, the parties are going to find themselves in a tight spot from the global powers.

I asked if there were any plans to do what got done in Ukraine last year. No, not yet, he said. The impression I got was right now the emphasis was to warm things up. People are slowly coming out in the open. There is this buildup. You have to go with that flow. You can't get too far ahead of the people.

Then we talked about the recent 12 point agreement between the Maoists and the parties. He said it was but an outline for a lot of serious homework that still needed doing. In another 10-15 days the Maoists and the parties might still get in dialogue mode. The problem has been a lack of trust. The most important thing is that trust is being built. That is the achievement.

Tripathy no longer thinks in terms of the four point agenda of the seven parties that came out months back. To him now there is this 12 point program between the eight parties. The four point agenda has been digested into this new document.

"This is not the work of the indoor revolutionaries," he said.

I asked if the palace has shown any signs of reacting positively to the agreement. The king is abroad, and we really don't intend to pay attention to the servants, he said.

Then I asked him about the moral and logistical support the Nepali diaspora can extend to the movement. He said most of the work to do with the movement is political in nature, it happens at the level of ideas. Logistical support is not exactly in high demand, he suggested.

This was my first conversation ever with Nepal. But with Tripathy I have a history. There were times when I sensed some anxiety in Tripathys' voice, as he felt more comfortable with me. I brought up the topic of there being two standing armies when the country goes through a constituent assembly. Old institutions will fall, new ones will take shape, he said.

The bottomline is both Nepal and Tripathy played a key role in bringing forth the 12 point agreement. This is not the end product. This is but a framework for trust building. This is the first time the Maoists have formally agreed to a multi-party democracy. They have to be commended. It could not have been easy.

Another bottomline is the seven party coalition leads the movement and Nepal and Tripathy both are key people, the rest of us are in support. They are doing the very best they can under extremely difficult circumstances. We have to exhibit a lot of patience with them, especially those of us at this end in the US.

I hope to talk to both and to others down the line. I just opened up a channel of communication. And I am not going to be reporting on all conversations either. My work is not journalism. What I am doing is political work.

In The News

BBC 103 FM returns to airwaves NepalNews
CPN-UML warns Govt. of ICC action
Issue passport to women without discrimination: SC
US criticizes the govt’s raid on Radio Sagarmatha
Their Majesties inspect Nepali peacekeeping force in Burundi
Journos, activists take out rally; 'Radio can resume its transmission': Minister Shahi
56 parties registered at Election Commission
Radio Sagarmatha moves SC against govt action
Britain cautiously welcomes alliance-Maoist pact
All four Radio Sagarmatha journos freed
US denounces govt crackdown on media in Nepal Outlook (subscription), India
Our loss in Nepal Daily Pioneer, India
Dipta Shah: The 12-Point Agenda – A Summary Scoop.co.nz (press release)
Let the monarchy pass into history Economic Times
Political Pact With Maoists Could Checkmate King Inter Press Service (subscription)
Talk to Maoists at Your Level: Nepal Tells Dist UML Leaders Himalayan Times, Nepal

Attack On Radio Sagarmatha: A Regime On Its Way Down

1. Attacks on politial parties.
2. Attacks on students.
3. Attacks on civil servants.
4. Attacks on the media in general.
5. Attacks on NGOs.
6. Recent atttack on Kantipur FM.
7. The Most recent attack on Radio Sagarmatha.
   

The list is long. This regime has a rather poor scorecard. That it is going down before February is a foregone conclusion. It could seek a soft landing. And you do that by exhibiting table manners.

The relentless attacks on the media is reprehensible. These are fascist tendencies.

Tanka Goebbels Dhakal


PRESS RELEASE
For Immediate Dissemination
27 November 2005
9: 45 PM

Nepal government raids radio station, shuts down transmission

Kathmandu - Radio Sagarmatha, the pioneering public radio station of Nepal, was raided tonight by the police for attempting to carry a BBC Nepali service relay broadcast that included the interview of the Maoist leader 'Prachanda'. The staff of the station has been taken away to an unknown location, equipment has been confiscated, and a letter from the state administration has been delivered to the station to forthwith suspend all broadcasts.

The interview with Prachanda dealt with the recent agreement between the political parties and the Maoist rebels to work towards a resolution of the conflict in the country. King Gyanendra is presently on a tour of Africa, and is expected back on 2 December.

Laxman Upreti, the Chairman of Radio Sagarmatha, said, "Nepal has been the South Asian country pioneering the role of FM radio in informing the public, and Radio Sagarmatha has been the vanguard of this movement. The action by the government is a dagger to the heart of our radio revolution."

Mr. Upreti said, "At this point, we are on the lookout for our staff taken in by the authorities. At this hour of crisis, we seek the support of all who value freedom of speech and expression in Nepal."

"According to our information, seven other radio stations around the country were also prevented from carrying the BBC Nepali service feed by security forces."

Simultaneously with the action by the government on Radio Sagarmatha, it has been learnt that the government has also suspended the BBC World Service English relay transmission from the government-owned Radio Nepal.

Coincidentally, Radio Sagarmatha was celebrating its 20th anniversary with an evening reception attended by high level government officials, among others, when the raid was carried out.

Contact: Ghamaraj Luitel, Tel: +977 1-98510-27344

In The News

Nepal government closes down radio station, arrests journalists Rediff, India
Raid on Radio Sagarmatha condemned, journos still in detention NepalNews
Raid on Radio Sagarmatha condemned, journos still in detention Nepali Times
Govt Closes Down Radio Sagarmatha NewsLine Nepal
Govt shuts down Sagarmatha FM Kathmandu Post
Nepali police raid radio station, detain reporters Reuters AlertNet, UK
Radio Sagarmatha goes off air, four journos still in custody Nepalnews.com, Nepal
Royal Govt Closes Down Pioneering Radio United We Blog, Nepal
Police seize equipment of Radio Sagarmatha, arrest five ... Nepali Times, Nepal
Nepal govt closes down radio station, arrests journalists Press Trust of India, India
NHRC 'helpless' before the government NepalNews
UML accuses authorities of misusing govt. machinery
Maoists ready to rethink on monarchy
Accept constituent assembly: Nepal Kathmandu Post, Nepal

Prachanda Audio Interview, A First

This is an amazing piece of work in audio journalism by Rabindra Mishra. This was much needed. I hope he similarly conducts more long audio interviews with many other Maoist leaders, and with elements of the regime. I wish he subjected the king to a similar cross questioning. If the king not be available, he could nab Tulsi Giri. Giri would do. All these shady elements need to be brought out of the woodworks. If the political process will not do it, gutsy journalism should shoulder the responsibility. Through this interview Mishra has also made an important political contribution.

Perhaps he will also take my questions over to the democratic camp. (Dinesh Wagle, 7 Leaders, 27 Questions)

BBC Audio File

Rabindra Mishra: King Gyanendra and Prachanda seem to have the key to the political crisis Nepal faces. We have not succeeded in our attempts to interview the king so far. But Prachanda talked to us. This was his first radio interview. Prachanda said if the king were to come forth for a free and fair elections to a constituent assembly, and if such an assembly were to retain a constitutional monarchy, that verdict will be acceptable to him and his party. The monarchy, the republic issue, and the issue of a constituent assembly have been hot, and so we focused mainly on those issues in our talk. My first question to him was as to why is the word "republic" absent in the recent 12 point agreement between the parties and the Maoists.

Prachanda: The essence of that 12 point agreement is to bring an end to the autocratic monarchy by seeking a way out through a constituent assembly. Our goal still is to end up a republic through a constituent assembly. The word "democracy" has been put there in English. But the essence is to bring autocracy to an end, to institutionalize the people's right to self-decision, and to go public with our slogan of a democratic republic among the people.

Rabindra Mishra: That is quite clear from the 12 point agreement. But what I am trying to figure out is are you agreeing to retaining the monarchy in some form, ceremonial or constitutional, if that might lead to a solution?

Prachanda: That is precisely what I am also trying to say. The essence of the 12 point agreement is not to accept the monarchy. It is to struggle against the autocratic monarchy.

Rabindra Mishra: If that is the essence, why is it not clear in the document?

Prachanda: This is an understanding between us and the seven parties. We all know all the seven parties have not come out for a republic with any clarity. But the document is headed towards what we have been saying for a long time now.

Rabindra Mishra: So your final goal is a democratic republic. The UML has the same goal. The Nepali Congress is now neutral on the monarchy question. If the palace were to reach out for reconciliation, how flexible are you willing to be?

Prachanda: We do not expect the palace to reach out if the past is any indication.

Rabindra Mishra: Maybe you have not seen that so far, but now after the 12 point agreement, and after the king returns back, if there are signs, how flexible are you willing to be?

Prachanda: We can comment on that only after we see the nature of such a signal. Our spirit is to move ahead. Our spirit is to take the country towards a republic.

Rabindra Mishra: Both the UML and you say that but, for now, if circumstances lead you to an agreement with the king, how flexible are you willing to be?

Prachanda: So far we have not seen any possibilities of any kind of an agreement with the king.

Rabindra Mishra: You have not seen so far. But to seek a way out of the crisis if you are forced to seek an agreement, how flexible are you willing to be?

Prachanda: We have not given any thought to that. The question about such a possibility is theoretical at best. If there is a solid signal, a genuine attempt to reach out to seek a forward looking solution on behalf of the country, then we can give some thought to it. But so far we have not seen any signs whatsoever. None.

Rabindra Mishra: You have repeatedly talked of state restructuring. If it were to become possible for the palace, the parties and you to together make that state restructuring possible, then you are willing to compromise, right?

Prachanda: That is not true. We went through two rounds of peace talks. During the last talks especially we sought a direct talk with the king to talk about the political, cultural, class-based, regional, sexual, and ethnic problems so as to seek a new structure, but there was an utter lack of interest from the king and the monarchy along those lines. Instead he responded by heaping autocracy. That is why your line of questioning is highly theoretical and mechanical.

Rabindra Mishra: Your 12 point agreement asks for an all party interim government that will take the country to a constituent assembly. But you have a disagreement. The parties want the House revived, you want a roundtable conference of all forces. But you agree on forming an interim government. Will that interim government have a representative of the king or not?

Prachanda: Our roadmap of a roudtable conference, interim government and a constituent assembly leaves no room for any representative from the king.

Rabindra Mishra: But if you will not make room for the king's representative, how do you expect the palace and the army to accept that?

Prachanda: It is not our goal to get accepted by the palace and the army. Because the palace has been so intent on thwarting the Nepali people's desire for peace and democracy, we see no alternative to creating a major storm of a revolution by the people. That is our understanding.

Rabindra Mishra: You talk about a storm. The parties talked of an impending tsunami. It did not happen. You have been waging your insurgency for a decade, but you have not been able to take over a single district headquarter. So if you look at the ground realities, and if you seriously seek a way out, and if there is a roundtable conference of all the political forces, and if that leads to an interim government, will that have a representative of the king or not?

Prachanda: We are confident now the storm of a revolution will come because ever since the royal palace massacre we have been trying to create a joint front with the parties. Now that that has materialized, the storm is on its way. That revolution will give birth to the interim government. That government will take the country to a constituent assembly.

Rabindra Mishra: Who will be the head of state when that interim government is formed?

Prachanda: The question of head of state and prime minister can be settled after a trust is generated between all parties after a successful revolution and when it is time to form the interim government.

Rabindra Mishra: If that be the case, why has that not been made clear in the 12 point agreement?

Prachanda: That is implied. The seven parties are still for House revival. They are not in any mood to get rid of that right now. We feel as we keep talking and interacting, we will all come around a common slogan down the line.

Rabindra Mishra: I see a lot of confusion here. Both the parties and you have been vocally critical of the king, but the agreement does not even mention the word republic. But then during interviews you all go after the king again. You talk tall about a republic. So instead of being in a strategic offensive, are you instead in the phase of a strategic deception?

Prachanda: Absolutely not. We have agreed on what we have agreed on. There is no attempt to hide or mislead.

Rabindra Mishra: So elections to a constituent assembly take place only after the monarchy has been abolished?

Prachanda: And why would that be? Why can't there be elections to a constituent assembly? It is absolutely possible. When the people's movement forges ahead, when there is a strong understanding between all political parties, then the revolution leads to an interim government that leads to a constituent assembly.

Rabindra Mishra: But according to you the monarchy has to end before the interim government can be formed. Is that not so?

Prachanda: The first emphasis of the 12 point agreement is to throw the ball into the king's court. It is for the king and the monarchists to now come forth saying how far they are willing to go to solve the national crisis. It is now their turn.

Rabindra Mishra: That is what I have been trying to figure out all along. If they are willing to seek a way out, if they are willing to soften their stance, are you also willing to soften your stance to seek common ground?

Prachanda: (A little agitated) I also said that much earlier, that question is highly theoretical at this stage. After that comes, what to do, that we can only decide later after studying the developments. The main issue right now is to create a movement to counter the king's autocracy. This is not a time to seek any understanding with the king.

Rabindra Mishra: No, it is still not clear. What is not clear is you yourself have suggested that the monarchy is abolished, and then the parties and you get together and a trustworthy person is made head of state. If that is the precondition for a constituent assembly, then an abolition of the monarchy is the precondition to a constituent assembly. Is that not the case according to you?

Prachanda: That sure is our goal. But we have also said all along that if all the forces in the country are willing to honestly go to a constituent assembly, then it is possible for all forces to go there together.

Rabindra Mishra: This is the clarity I was seeking. So if the king were to now come forth for a constituent assembly then it would be possible to go to a constituent assembly while the king is still around, no problem, right?

Prachanda: That is something for the king and the monarchists to make clear.

Rabindra Mishra: So if they were to clearly come forth for such an assembly, then it is not problematic that the monarchy is still around while the country goes for a constituent assembly, right?

Prachanda: If they can get clear on that, we can give thought to that.

Rabindra Mishra: Looks like you have really softened, haven't you?

Prachanda: What do you call softening? Nepal is in a crisis, and the people want peace and democracy. Our flexibility is for the people. That sure is.

Rabindra Mishra: So you are going to accept the outcome of the constituent assembly, whatever it might be, right?

Prachanda: We said that a long time ago. We have made that very clear in the 12 point agreement. We are committed to accepting the outcome of a constituent assembly that might be the result of free, fair elections. We have made that very clear.

Rabindra Mishra: So if that assembly comes to the conclusion that the monarchy is to be retained, you are going to accept that?

Prachanda: We don't believe the Nepali people will say that. But if that is what they say, we will respect that.

Rabindra Mishra: I see a clash here. On the one hand the monarchy has to be abolished before there can be elections to a constituent assembly. But then if the people want it back, you are going to reestablish that overthrown monarchy?

Prachanda: That is not how it is. If all the forces were to agree to a constituent assembly, all forces will get the opportunity to present themselves to the people. What we are saying is when that happens, we absolutely, totally do not believe the Nepali people will keep the monarchy that has repeatedly attacked their freedom.

Rabindra Mishra: You talked about my theoretical question. Is that not your theoretical wish? But if the people do keep the monarchy despite your wish, will you accept it?

Prachanda: We have said we will respect the people's verdict.

Rabindra Mishra: The clash still is that you want the monarchy abolished before the constituent assembly, but then you will agree to reestablish it if the people say so through the assembly.

Prachanda: That is not the case. The flaw in your logic is that you are not seeing we are willing to accept constituent assembly elections and UN supervision.

Rabindra Mishra: In the 12 point agreement you talk of elections and supervision by the UN or another trustworthy third party. Do you think India will agree to that?

Prachanda: We have not specified any country. We have not intended to specify either.

Rabindra Mishra: What India has been saying is the Nepalis themselves should solve the problems among them. Outsiders can only help. India is against UN involvement. Does that not make it impractical to seek UN involvement?

Prachanda: We don't see any reason why the UN should not be accepted. But if that is a problem, that is why we have left options open for some other trustworthy third party. India, China, Europe, America. We think we need help from all of those powers.

Rabindra Mishra: Have you talked to the Indians about this?

Prachanda: No, we have not had such talks.

Rabindra Mishra: So after elections to a constituent assembly are conducted under such supervision, you are willing to discard your weapons. True?

Prachanda: What we have been saying is after the constituent assembly election results are out, according to those results, the two armies should be integrated, and one unified army has to take shape. We have made clear there is such a peaceful resolution to the problem.

Rabindra Mishra: Let's talk a little about the Indian role in Nepal's politics. For the longest time you have been talking loud about Indian expansionism and American imperialism. But recent developments have shown India is very important also to you as the larger Nepali politics. Many are calling you India's pawn now.

Prachanda: That is absolutely baseless. Nepal's crisis and geopolitical reality lead us to think we need help from India, China and the other world powers. We are clear on that.

Rabindra Mishra: If it be that important, why have you been badmouthing India for the longest time?

Prachanda: There are ideological stands we take. Those are there for sure.

Rabindra Mishra: When you met the Nepali leaders in India recently, were you aided by the Indian intelligence agencies?

Prachanda: We held the politial dialogue through our own initiatives. We did not experience or feel any external help.

Rabindra Mishra: That makes the Indian intelligence agencies look incapable. When all the top Nepali leaders went to Delhi and met you, they had no inkling.

Prachanda: That is not something we can comment on. What is for sure is that after the king's 2/1 misadventure, new interactions have become possible. New fermentations have been taking place. Most parties are talking for democracy. We don't think the government was in a total dark. But we did not experience or feel any involvement or help.

Rabindra Mishra: Your three month long ceasefire is about to expire in a few days. Will you extend it?

Prachanda: We declared our three month long unilateral ceasefire out of respect for the people's desire for peace and democracy. But the royal army has murdered more than 25 of our cadres during this time period. More than 50 have been disappeared. Under such circumstances, it is very difficult for us to extend the ceasefire even if we might want to. But still there is one week left. We are thinking. We are deliberating.

Rabindra Mishra: You have spent 10 years circling the villages. How much longer will you stay that way?

Prachanda: Our central committe met recently. We evaluated. We have decided on a new direction. The class imbalance of power in the villages has changed. The feudal structure in the villages has been smashed. We have been trying to build a new structure. The country is looking for a political outlet. The central committee has decided to move beyond the villages to the urban areas and to the strategic installations.

Rabindra Mishra: What will you do for that?

Prachanda: The 12 point agreement has been the outcome of the new direction sought by the central committee.

Rabindra Mishra: Will there be other attacks?

Prachanda: It is less about attacks. Our major thrust is to take our political moblization to a whole new level.

Rabindra Mishra: All the lives that have been lost during the 10 years, people blame both the state and you. Do you think of yourself as a sinner or a sage?

Prachanda: Look, Rabindraji, this is a huge insurrection. The 237 year old feudal structure has been revolted against. This has been for justice. Everything has not happened the way we have wanted. This is not about sinner or sage. Human society develops through such revolts. Hundreds of thousands have been sacrificed in other circumstances. This can not be measured emotionally, it has to be measured scientifically, factually.

Rabindra Mishra: That was Prachanda.

Baburam Bhattarai Interview

Rabindra Mishra, An Unprofessional, Disrespectful Journalist